Why doesn't Titleist make flatter than 2 degree heads

Started by : Timmy W |

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Timmy W


I need a 5 degree flat head with 1 inch longer but Titleist doesn't make heads that flat can anyone give me an explanation why

Timmy W


is their a way i can have titleist bend them and then sign off saying i accept the flaking

Cathi, Titleist Club Concierge


Hi Timmy,  We can bend one of the chromed heads an additional one, maybe two degrees - we will not bend any head 5 flat. 

Quintin H


By adding length you are in effect making the club play more upright. Lie angle and shaft length go together to make the fit, by going 5* flat then adding a longer shaft means you went too far flat.

Go for 3* flat and standard length, should be pretty darn close.

Quintin H


Sorry that should be 3* flat and an inch short.

Lou G


Timmy W

is their a way i can have titleist bend them and then sign off saying i accept the flaking

Why not make the 1" short and 3* flat - that way they would bend a 2* flat head only 1*?  You would need a light grip (such as Winn Lite or Dri-Tac Lite) to compensate for the swing weight loss of 6 points.

I'm 6'1" and play 1/2 upright and 1/2" short on the 7-PW (I use Excel RF grips).   I play standard length on the Vokeys (1/2* upright on SW and 1* upright on LW and XW) and stock grips.  I play my fairway wood and hybrid 1.5* upright at 1" short with Dri Tac grips.  I also use a 44.5" driver.

Also, a club 1" longer than standard is going tobe  6 swingweight points heavier.

John O


Given this I wonder what I would do to get a 4 degree flat AP 2 iron?

John O


Would that be 3 flat and 1/2" short to get a 4 flat iron.

Lou G


The degree of flatness should be the same as the shortening of shafts (from the 5 iron down).  A standard 9 iron would be 36" shaft with 64*.  If you cut the 9 iron down to 35.5" you would change the lie angle to 64.5*.

 

Quintin H


John O

Would that be 3 flat and 1/2" short to get a 4 flat iron.

It would be the same as the above problem, 4* flat is the same as 5* flat 1 inch long, you would also go 3* flat 1 inch short.

Lou G


The other thing is that with a shorter shaft you get more control with your shots. 

 

Timmy W


I dont see how length and lie go together because i need the length so i am able to stand up and not slouch and i need the flatness because i want it to be hit in the center of the club face

Quintin H


Timmy W

I dont see how length and lie go together because i need the length so i am able to stand up and not slouch and i need the flatness because i want it to be hit in the center of the club face

You add 1in then flatten the club 1* you have basically the same setup as standard.

start with 9iron, add 1 inch, you now have a 9i with a 7i length shaft and 9i lie angle........now flatten the lie angle 1 * and you have a 9i with 7i shaft length and 7i lie angle, so you basically have a standard 7i with a 9i head,

Timmy W


I dont really understand the point ur trying to make and it still has 9 iron loft

808HACKER


Cathi, Titleist Club Concierge

Hi Tim,  We only bend our AP2 chromed heads 2° and have heads built at 2° upright to accommodate those players that need it bent more than two upright.  In order to bend them more than 2° flat, we would have to create a new head that is already 2 flat so that it can be bent further.  We just don't get that many requests for even 2 flat to build a new head. What happens is that in a forged, chromed head, when you bend more than two degrees, you take the chance on crimping the chrome, which could (not always) cause flaking in the future.  It won't affect performance if it flakes, just looks.  If you are looking at an AP1 head, we can bend those up to 4° flat because they are a polished, not chromed, head.  The only caveat is that you (the player) has to sign off on the fact that there may be stress marks on the club due to the extreme bending.   

Hi Cathi,

I just had my AP2's bent to 3 degrees flat and the staff at my local Galaxy Golf never mentioned to me that if I bend 3 degrees flat that I take the risk of my clubs flaking.  Will my clubs eventually flake because I've bent them 3 degrees flat? Should I contact Golf Galaxy to let them know what could happen to my clubs because of the bending and see what they can do?

Kind regards.




Cathi, Titleist Club Concierge


Hi,  GG repairs will warranty the work that they do.  If it flakes, that will not affect performance, just looks.  It may not flake at all - we just let players know as a precautionary note.   Go ahead and contact them so that they can explain their warranty process to you.

Lou G


Timmy W

I dont see how length and lie go together because i need the length so i am able to stand up and not slouch and i need the flatness because i want it to be hit in the center of the club face

Length and lie go hand in hand.   If you play a long club you need a flatter lie angle to make the clubhead contact the ground in the center of the sole.  If the club is short, you need a more upright lie angle to do the same.  This is why a standard 7 iron is 37" with a 63* lie angle and a 9 iron is 36" with a 64* lie angle.   The 9 iron head is heavier because of the shorter shaft.

The Png fit chart goes down 3.75 flat (Gold).  Titleist standard lie is equivalent to Blue Dot (.75 upright).   Club lengths are about the same.   For someone to use Gold Dot with a +1" shaft (same as Titleist 4.5 flat), he/she would have to be about 6'7" tall with a wrist to floor height of 30.5 inches.    Even Orange Dot 1" short (same as Titleist 3 flat) would have to be a person that is 5'0" tall with a wrist to floor height of 31.5"  and standard length for a person 6'0" tall with a WTF of 32".

That having been said, it implies that you have a very horizontal golf swing.

Lou G


Timmy W

I need a 5 degree flat head with 1 inch longer but Titleist doesn't make heads that flat can anyone give me an explanation why

The only one that makes an extreme range of lie angles is Png.  Gold Dot (-3.75*) to Maroon Dot (+4.5*).   Titleist Standard Lie and Blue Dot (+.75*) are about the same lie angles but the Png short irons are more upright and the long  irons are flat (mainly because of the .75* spacing).    Most (very close to all) will not bend Png irons because of the risk of breakage and what they do is send them back.  The other issue is Mitchell machines read upright by 2*.