Hi Jim, it may be something as simple as ball placement.

Jim E

3 weeks ago I went to my local PGA professional for a Titleist Vokey wedge fitting as they recommend.  The pro was very informative and helpful.  He fitted me for a 52-08, 56-08 and a 60-04 all 2 degree up.  a week later they arrived and I couldn't wait to start dialing them in.  Well it took about 6 balls and I was nailing the target.  On full shots they are lazar accurate and feel like heaven in your hands.  My problem is when the pro fitted me is was all done on a hitting mat.  The bounce worked great on the mat, but I am struggling with my short game.  Funny..That was the best part of my game and now I'm lost.

I'm going back this evening to talk to the shop and I'm hoping they can help me out.  Has anyone else been in this mess before?  

I did ask him at the fitting if they would work as well in the grass.  He said yes.  But the 60*-04 slides uder the ball and clacks off the upper part of the face in the second cut of grass and the 52* and 56* slide under the ball in the sand and pops it upward about 2/3's of what i need.

Any advised?

 

Ball placement is part of it. For the 56, I would have gotten a 56-11 because you need a sand wedge that works in softer sand. The 60-04 should be played a little bit forward because you don't want to dig a hole. My setup is 50-08 (bent to 51), 54-11 (bent to 55), 58-04 and 62-07. I can hit the 58-04 out of somewhat soft sand but its primary purpose is tight lies and hard sand. When you have a lower bounce wedge in a bunker, play the ball more forward (off your front foot) and hit 2-3 inches behind it (you have to sweep it); I've trained myself to hit a 9 iron or PW for super long bunker shots.

I spoke with the staff yesterday at my local shop and spent some time chipping and pitching balls from around the chipping area and have fine tuned my needs.  I going to keep the 52-08 that is 1 degree strong for my pitch and run shots.  Going to replace the 56-08 with a 56-11.  I can get the bounce from the sand and rough to get the ball where I need it.  They didn't have a 60-07 for me to try out.  but spent some time with a 58-11 and it had more bounce than i needed.  I'm hoping to try the 60-07 for the more lofted shots.

Best thing of all, the local guys are going to put me in the right club.  I really...really hated dinging these new club faces trying to learn to use them and giving them back.  They have earned my business from now on.

Thanks for the input.

Jim, I'm curious, what was the processes to be fit for wedges?

Did you pitch and chip with various wedges?

Did you hit full swing shots with various wedges?

I find it odd that it was recommended the lowest bounce wedges for each loft. I thought it was standard practice for even a slider to have one big bounce wedge, usually the SW. Because, even for a slider, there are situations where higher bounce will work better.

Quintin H

Jim, I'm curious, what was the processes to be fit for wedges?

Did you pitch and chip with various wedges?

Did you hit full swing shots with various wedges?

I find it odd that it was recommended the lowest bounce wedges for each loft. I thought it was standard practice for even a slider to have one big bounce wedge, usually the SW. Because, even for a slider, there are situations where higher bounce will work better.

I concur with Quintin. Your sand wedge needs to be able to hit in soft bunkers and thick grass. I have a 54-11 Spin-Milled c-c and I had it bent to 55 mainly because I've got a comfort zone with a 55 wedge. It works well in most conditions mainly due to the narrow sole. I tried a 56-14 and it was good in only one situation: super soft sand; had to do a digging shot (I had a 90 day playability guarantee so I returned it). I also took a 256-10 (cost me a whole $10) and bent it to 57-11 and it worked in a wide variety of condition but didn't have the intestinal fortitude for medium length bunker shots. My gap wedge is a SM cc 50-08 bent to 51. I have enough bounce on it to hit out of thick grass and for long bunker shots in soft sand and still low enough bounce for most fairway shots. I'm not a fan of 52-08 wedges because they don't do much for me (minimal yardage diff between them and my sand wedge, they're just about useless on long bunker shots). I have an Eye 2 + PW (48.5) and it has a leading edge with a lot of bounce. In regards to the 58... I tried a 58-12 SM cc and I had to play a digging shot for the most part (returned it and got my 62-07, which I absolutely love to death). I just got a 58-04 Spin-Milled c-c with the intent of a low bounce lob wedge for the munis and some of the less better kept courses. Don't let the bounce fool you on that wedge. It has a very wide flange that is a bit rounded and I would venture to say that it has a head profile like an old school sand wedge. I can hit tight lie shots, grassy shots and even hit a bunker shot out of a soft trap (I had no one behind me and I already hit my ball on the green so I dropped a ball in the bunker and it extracted it nicely). 60-07 - I had a Spin-Milled for over a year and it did its fair share of great shots. It was what I used in hard sand and for tight fairways but its limitation was soft bunkers and thick grass. My 64-07 was the opposite: I could hit out of thick grass and in deep bunkers but had to de-loft it on tight lies to the point it would be more effective to hit a straightforward shot with a 60-07. I switched both out for a 62-07 Spin-Milled c-c and it has been great because it works in various conditions because of the wider flange (I conquered the Bunker From Hell at Riverwalk Friars #8 yesterday; it has about an 8 foot rise to the green from the bottom and I put my shot 5' from the pin). About a year ago I tried a used 260-04 and it was great on tight lies but would dig a hole on most well kept courses. I would classify my wedge play as "shotmaker". I play slider shots on soft lies and digger off tight lies. I also found the 58-04 good for hitting a severe downhill lie pitch/chip to a green below (I'd skull my other wedges in this situation). Did you ever think about a 60-10? I constructed a Snake Eyes 600W lob wedge and used it for 2 years until I got the Vokey 60-07. You could certainly bend a 60-10 to 59-09. Just being objective, the impression I get in some of these forums is people think about how far they hit the ball or how they pitch or chip with their wedges but never how they extract a ball out of a bunker. Quite frankly, a lot of golfers (even some that shoot in the 80s) are very weak at sand shots. I'm one of the 3 percent that practice bunkers and 23 percent that practice 50 yard pitch shots.

He just had me hitting full shots off the mat at first.  Then I hit a few off of the lie board.  He took the reading from the tape he put on the club and came up with the numbers.  I messed around with them doing some short pitches and chip shot. even flopped a few 56* and 60*.  After we finished I ask if they would hit the same from the grass and he said yes.  But I had a terrible time trying to make these work.

Last night I met with him again and we took the wedge out into the grass and hit from tight lies and from the rough.  We both agree I needed more bounce.  Sticking with the 52-08.  It is lazar accurate on full shots and is a great pitch and run club.  Traded in the 56-08 for a 56-11.  This club has enough bounce to get me out of the sand, plus land a few high soft shots around the flag.  And lastly I'm trading the 60-04 (OMG) for a 60-07  That club was like sticking a axe in the ground.  the more lofted version works perfect.

I really hated bring the semi new wedges back scratched and dinged up.  But we worked out a reasonible exchange and I am very happy.

Because of their service, I'll purchase my new irons from them soon.

One word. Practice.

Jim E

He just had me hitting full shots off the mat at first.  Then I hit a few off of the lie board.  He took the reading from the tape he put on the club and came up with the numbers.  I messed around with them doing some short pitches and chip shot. even flopped a few 56* and 60*.  After we finished I ask if they would hit the same from the grass and he said yes.  But I had a terrible time trying to make these work.

Last night I met with him again and we took the wedge out into the grass and hit from tight lies and from the rough.  We both agree I needed more bounce.  Sticking with the 52-08.  It is lazar accurate on full shots and is a great pitch and run club.  Traded in the 56-08 for a 56-11.  This club has enough bounce to get me out of the sand, plus land a few high soft shots around the flag.  And lastly I'm trading the 60-04 (OMG) for a 60-07  That club was like sticking a axe in the ground.  the more lofted version works perfect.

I really hated bring the semi new wedges back scratched and dinged up.  But we worked out a reasonible exchange and I am very happy.

Because of their service, I'll purchase my new irons from them soon.

Good choice. Like I said, my experience with the 60-04 is it dug a hole to China. The 58-04 is more rounded so it doesn't dig and actually works in a soft bunker. I've brought back wedges I didn't like - Golf Mart has a 90 day playability guarantee on new and used clubs. I tried a 48-06 and totally struggled with it on the golf course and also returned a 58-12 after finding out in practice that it didn't do what I needed. I'm quite happy with my setup of 50-08 (51-09 bent), 54-11 (55-12 bent), 58-04 and 62-07. I even conquered the Bunker From Hell with the 62-07!

Carl T

One word. Practice.

Be part of the 3% that practices bunker shots and 25% that practice 50 yard pitch shots. I am. The main thing is practice something besides the standard ho-hum pitch shots and chip shots on a flat surface. I find that a "ball below the feet" lie is much easier than a "ball above the feet" lie. Try things like pitching on a mound with severe downhill slope (the trick is the right foot is partly off the ground at address for righties).

When you practice bunker shots my advice is to practice for the 10 yard range as 90% of green side bunker play is from this range. I think of a "V" type swing for these shots. For green side bunker play for loger distance I think "U".

There is a good tip that helped me play consistent bunker shots. Place a dollar bill under the ball with the latter 2" or so from the rear of the bill. You want to hit under the dollar bill (that's how long your path should be). The bottom line is you hit 2" behind the ball and play it off your left heel. You generally want to sweep the ball (there is that characteristic slapping sound). All the weight should be on the front foot. Zero body motion on the backswing (lower body should remain square). The "V" or "U" would more or less come by nature (you'll be taking a shorter backswing and follow thru on a bunker with a lower lip and a full backswing and high follow thru on a high bunker shot). I practice bunker shots with my 9 iron thru the 62 wedge. There is one greenside bunker where the bottom is 8 feet below the putting surface (Riverwalk Friars #8 - The Bunker From Hell). I conquered it and put my shot 5 ft from the pin 2 weeks ago. My SM cc 58-04, believe it or not, is a great greenside bunker club. The leading edge appears to have about 15 deg of bounce (got a wide, rounded bottom). For most bunkers I use my 54-11 (have it set at 55-12). I do long bunker shots with my 50-08 and 9 iron (45*). A Eye 2+ "W" is also a great long bunker shot club (has a high bounce leading edge).

Hoping the new wedges are here today or tomorrow.  I practice my short game more than anything else.  It's the strongest part of my game.  Not long off the tee, 230 to 250, so I'm some where in the 150 yard range going in to the green.  I hit my share of GIR's but not as many as I'd like.  So these wedges are my go to clubs.  plus I really enjoy pitching and chipping to targets.  My Putting..UGH!  I don't want to talk about that. 

The combanation of wedges I went with will allow me every shot I can pull off.  The 52-08 works great for the chip and run shot, plus enough bounce to assist with the longer bunker shots.  The 56-11 can help me get the altitude for higher shots, plus those fuffy lies that a less bounced wedge will slide under the ball.  And the 60-07 for those days I fly the green and come back to the down hill pitch and need the ball to release less.  I have even flopped a few in at times.  not as hard to do as I thought it would be.  And by the time you flopped 2 or 3 buckets, you'll get pretty good at it.

Jim E

    

I've gotten a couple sneaky birds with the 60-07 by holing out. Most memorable was the over the bunker shot on Friars #8 from 20 yd. I feel your pain on putting. My nemesis is 6-10 ft putts (need to hole more out). I also had a chance to break par at National City about 2 years ago and missed 3 birdie putts by an INCH. Flop and cut shots are a piece of cake. My 62-07 is my go to wedge when I have to drop the ball on a dime from 30 yards in.

Lou G

There is a good tip that helped me play consistent bunker shots. Place a dollar bill under the ball with the latter 2" or so from the rear of the bill. You want to hit under the dollar bill (that's how long your path should be). The bottom line is you hit 2" behind the ball and play it off your left heel. You generally want to sweep the ball (there is that characteristic slapping sound). All the weight should be on the front foot. Zero body motion on the backswing (lower body should remain square). The "V" or "U" would more or less come by nature (you'll be taking a shorter backswing and follow thru on a bunker with a lower lip and a full backswing and high follow thru on a high bunker shot). I practice bunker shots with my 9 iron thru the 62 wedge. There is one greenside bunker where the bottom is 8 feet below the putting surface (Riverwalk Friars #8 - The Bunker From Hell). I conquered it and put my shot 5 ft from the pin 2 weeks ago. My SM cc 58-04, believe it or not, is a great greenside bunker club. The leading edge appears to have about 15 deg of bounce (got a wide, rounded bottom). For most bunkers I use my 54-11 (have it set at 55-12). I do long bunker shots with my 50-08 and 9 iron (45*). A Eye 2+ "W" is also a great long bunker shot club (has a high bounce leading edge).

My brother taught me the dollar bill visual and it is what I use. Also agree with your set up with one exception on weight being forward. If you find you are taking too much sand on level bunker play, place more weight on rear foot to take a more shallow path. For down hill bunker play you definetly want your weight forward and for up hill you want your weight back. Zero body motion on back swing as you mention is the key with a continuing follow through after making contact with the sand (exception with plugged lies where you just want to stick the club behind the ball and just pop the ball out). Don't mean to hi-jack thread but got a question for you Lou. For wet sand what wedge do you play for the 10 yard bunker shot and swing thought for this situation ? Say the ball is on a level lie with lip just a couple of feet high. We have had a lot rain lately and under normal condtions I use my 58-08 for this shot. My other wedges are 54,50 and 45.